SIDE A:
CONTENT WARNING: Ableism, use of ‘R-word’ in reference to a person with an intellectual disability.
AB was born on May 20, 1920 in North Bay, Ontario. AB describes his early sexual experiences, and his first learning about sexuality. AB joined the Navy in 1941, to prevent being drafted into…
SIDE A:
CONTENT WARNING: Ableism, use of ‘R-word’ in reference to a person with an intellectual disability.
AB was born on May 20, 1920 in North Bay, Ontario. AB describes his early sexual experiences, and his first learning about sexuality. AB joined the Navy in 1941, to prevent being drafted into the Army. AB discusses the controversy around a gay relationship involving a young man with an intellectual disability, while in the Navy. AB later attended art school. AB also discusses living a part of his life where he required a great deal of psychiatric attention, AB discusses various beverage rooms and hotels across the city that were popular amongst gay men in the 1940s. AB found a long term partner, who also needed help with his mental health. They began to see a psychiatrist together, who AB feels intentionally was turning them against each other out of homophobia. AB became sick and needed open-heart surgery, and got post-operative depression exacerbated by a home robbery. A friend of AB was killed in High Park a few days before the interview.
Transcript available: F0083-02-002
Dates and locations discussed: North Bay, Ontario, Toronto, 1940s, 1980s
SIDE B:
AB discusses his various partners and homes after moving in Toronto, and the social circles he was a part of. AB had mostly straight friends, and would go to/have gay parties, straight parties and mixed parties. AB has not had any run-ins with the police due to being gay, but he has had a run-in with the police for other reasons. AB also recalls a story where his nephew visited him in Toronto, while he was living at the City Park apartments. Despite his nephew having a wife, his nephew asked him where to go to pick up a man. His nephew also told him that, while his nephew was in the army, he had had a couple affairs with men. AB recounts his stories of going to Buffalo. He went to visit Buffalo because ‘Toronto was rather boring’. AB feels that the queer community is more distant at time of interview than it once was. He mentions a petition a friend put up at Glad Day bookstore about trying the young men who murdered a gay man in High Park in court as adults; the petitition received a negligible number of signatures. AB also mentions his experience visiting the Oakleaf steambaths, and finding them very ‘ho hum’. AB begins to ask questions about Lionel, and whether Lionel cruises. Finding out that Lionel does cruise, AB asks Lionel if he is afraid of HIV/AIDS. Lionel insists he is very safe, and also explains that he does not want to lose his sexuality out of fear. Lionel discusses the police crackdown on cruising in parks in the summer of 1985. AB asks if Lionel thinks the police are afraid that ‘Toronto will become another San Francisco, where the ‘gays are so strong’ that they carry political weight. Lionel responds yes. The recording ends, but then starts again with AB describing Peter Marshall — he says that ‘everyone was in awe of Peter Marshall’.
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, Buffalo, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier.
SIDE A:
AK was born in 1928. AK lived in Ottawa for most of his childhood, and then moved to Toronto for 10 years. AK then moved back to Ottawa, then to England for 20 years, and then back to Toronto. AK discusses first sexual experiments, at age 6 or 7, with a neighbour. AK was later the best man …
SIDE A:
AK was born in 1928. AK lived in Ottawa for most of his childhood, and then moved to Toronto for 10 years. AK then moved back to Ottawa, then to England for 20 years, and then back to Toronto. AK discusses first sexual experiments, at age 6 or 7, with a neighbour. AK was later the best man of his wedding. AK discusses the various terminology used for gay men, including “homosexual”, “queer” and “pansy” — but also mentions that his parents would not have known these words. AK was open about his sexuality once with his sister, who said that she doesn’t mind what he does, but that he doesn’t perform it in her home. AK discusses various popular places that gay people would go out at night: Letros, the beverage room at the Ford Hotel, the beverage room at the King Edward Hotel. AK discusses how various bar regulations and liquor laws shaped interactions and cruising at these bars. AK also mentions of the Park Plaza being close to the park behind the museum (Philosopher’s Walk). Despite having lived on Wood St, AK lived there before it was part of the “Gay Ghetto” or Church Wellesley Village. AK also discusses about drugs in the gay scene in the 1940’s — particularly Benzadryl. AK also mentions a restaurant, Murray’s, with cruisey washrooms, popular amongst gays starting in the early evening. AK met George Hislop at Murray’s in 1951-1952. AK describes George at that time.
Dates and locations discussed: Ottawa, Toronto, England, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s
SIDE B:
AK discusses working as a clerk for militia training, and cruising the men who were stripping before their medical. AK got fired, but wants the interview to be anonymous if he was to disclose why. He lost his job because of a complaint from a priest. After losing the job, he moved to England. AK mentions homosexuality being decriminalized in England. AK discusses various cruisey places and bars in England, and sexual experiences he had there.
Dates and locations discussed: Ottawa, Toronto, England, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s
F
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
SIDE C:
AK discusses bringing straight friends to gay bars later in life. He also briefly discusses the history of Cavaliers. This tape has a second recording where AK describes ‘palaces’ in Montreal — cheap overnight rooms for rent owned by gay men.
Dates and locations discussed: Montreal, Toronto…
SIDE C:
AK discusses bringing straight friends to gay bars later in life. He also briefly discusses the history of Cavaliers. This tape has a second recording where AK describes ‘palaces’ in Montreal — cheap overnight rooms for rent owned by gay men.
Dates and locations discussed: Montreal, Toronto, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
SIDE A:
Note: The archivist notes that, on the label of this tape, it mentions that these are recordings off of an original 120min tape.
No interviewer appears to be present for this entire interview. The audio is recorded in collated clips. One of the interviewees (whom the archivist believes is l…
SIDE A:
Note: The archivist notes that, on the label of this tape, it mentions that these are recordings off of an original 120min tape.
No interviewer appears to be present for this entire interview. The audio is recorded in collated clips. One of the interviewees (whom the archivist believes is likely to be Doug Chin) mentions that there are a lot of problems, but does not specific with what. The interviewee mentions problems with staff, settings, and service users. The interviewee appears to be talking about a hypothetical facility, to satisfy needs including counselling, and privacy. The tape cuts. Another recording starts, with the same interviewee. They continue discussing the needs of the facility. The tape cuts and starts again, discussing the same subject. This happens again. The interviewee recommends a site for the facility: Basil’s at Gerrard and Yonge. The interviewee recommends the city purchase the entire building, to produce this facility. The interviewee mentions taking their proposals to “Chris King”, and being accused of ‘tokenism’. But, the interviewee asserts, diverse hiring practice is not tokenism, it is diversity. In another clip, the second interviewee (whom the archivist strongly believes is Bob Allard) joins the interview approx. 27 mins. They discuss how, while gay kids and straight youth may have similar problems, the approaches must be different. The two interviewees discuss the state of various legal cases they are involved in.
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, 1970s, 1980s
SIDE B:
The archivist notes that the sound is quite poor on this side of the tape, and it is occasionally difficult to understand the interviewees. The interviewees discuss the difficulties and strain of working in community engagement. They debate the dangers of being too involved against the importance of being emotionally involved as a counsellor or social worker. The two take firm opposing stances. The recording cuts out 13 minutes in, and returns at 14 minutes. The audio becomes extremely distorted. The interviewees briefly discuss their sexualities — one calls themself a “slut,” and mentions having had sex with 15 men in one night at the bathhouse. The two interviewees call themselves the “doers”. One (whom the archivist believes to be Doug Chin) discusses the possibility of running for mayor. They mention Tri-Aid and discuss expanding Tri-Aid. The board of directors at Tri-Aid have asserted that they do not want the interviewee to run for mayor. The interviewee mentions being president of a Chinese community association, and the other interviewee discusses the movement of Chinese populations in Toronto. The other interviewee describes what drew him to Tri-Aid. The interviewee answers a phone call, and asks about the price of buying a building at Yonge and Gerrard (which the archivist believes to be the Basil’s building mentioned on Side A).
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, 1980s
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
SIDE C:
In this brief recording, the interviewees continue their conversation from the previous tape. Audio cuts at two minutes.
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, 1980s
SIDE C:
In this brief recording, the interviewees continue their conversation from the previous tape. Audio cuts at two minutes.
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, 1980s
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
Transcript available, see F0083-03-001 Transcript of Interview with David Allandyle
SIDES A and B:
David, a 60 year old gay man at the time of the interview, discusses his long-term relationships and friendships in Toronto after World War II. He came out in the 1940s after being in service, while …
Transcript available, see F0083-03-001 Transcript of Interview with David Allandyle
SIDES A and B:
David, a 60 year old gay man at the time of the interview, discusses his long-term relationships and friendships in Toronto after World War II. He came out in the 1940s after being in service, while he studied Political Science and Economics at the University of Toronto. The interview covers David’s early life, family and friendships, being gay at work, the gay bar culture in Toronto, cruising in streets and parks in the city, occasional sexual encounters, police surveillance, his stance on psychiatric therapy, and his participation on demonstrations marching up Yonge street after the bath-house raids. David also discusses politics, defining himself as a conservative, his work experience in branch stores and in the field of interior design, as well as his rejection of the current gay culture.
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s.
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
Digital copy and original audio cassette. Original cassette tape located in A/V room.
SIDE A:
This recording begins mid-sentence. Alldread and Collier discuss an alcoholic mutual friend. Alldread works in a show store. He comes from Bowmanville, Ontario. He grew up during the Depression. At age 16, he moved to Toronto and stayed at the YMCA (“the worst place any young innocent can …
SIDE A:
This recording begins mid-sentence. Alldread and Collier discuss an alcoholic mutual friend. Alldread works in a show store. He comes from Bowmanville, Ontario. He grew up during the Depression. At age 16, he moved to Toronto and stayed at the YMCA (“the worst place any young innocent can stay”). At the time, he worked in office work and joined a theatre group. He was very artistic as a child, but not very academic. Growing up, he used to dress up a lot for parades, etc. but did not know anything about gay life. In high school, he felt the other boys were much more masculine / “macho” than him. He went to a boys camp at age 15 (the YMCA camp, just north of Ottawa). He took a train there, and could tell that the officer who helped him on the train was gay. At camp, no-one knew Alldread was a ‘sissy’, this allowed him to do things he normally wouldn’t. He went swimming nude with an older boy while at the camp. His first introduction to gay life was while working for Canadian Fairbanks Morris company. He met a young French man from Ottawa staying at Royal York, named Marcel Paris). They were very romantic with one another, but a few laters Marcel died. Alldread mentions that he has never considered himself ‘gay’, and that he is ‘more bisexual’. Alldread was born in 1931, and first moved to Toronto in the late 1940s or early 1950s. He describes his other love affairs, including a man named Tony, a dancer from Jamaica. Alldread goes nn to describes the YMCA in further detail, and experiences visiting Retros. He then moved to Oakwood and St Clair in Toronto. He also mentions introducing Tony to his parents, but his parents not knowing he was gay because ‘people didn’t know gays’ at that time. He describes many of his other friends. He also describes marrying a woman at age 27. He has since divorced; he feels glad that they divorced as he still wants children and she didn’t, and she had eyes on other guys. He also describes meeting a guy in High Park the day before the interview.
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, Bowmanville, 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s
SIDE B:
Alldread describes the downstairs area of Letros, and how George Letros would have to let you in. He also describes the Halloween costume party at Letros. Alldread was known for his drag. His first drag name was Anita. He did not begin performing at the 511 until after he was divorced. Alldread narrates how he first got into drag; first started through musical theatre. He mentions he was the only drag queen that they would let into Retros dressed up. He worked in drag in the weekend, and selling shoes on weekdays. Only later on did he take on the drag name “Michelle DuBarry”. He also describes his friendship with George Letros, and how Letros’s brother ‘screwed him’ out of his business (the Letros bar/tavern). He also describes Peter Marshall. He also describes the Quest bar. He describes Peter Marshall’s parties, and the types of people who would attend. He then describes moving into the City Park apartments in their very first year, with Jack Sloane. He describes how there was no gay neighbourhood before the City Park apartments. He describes some of the popular venues in the 1950s: the King Edward Hotel, the Park Plaza, the Grange, the Parkside, the Bay House, etc.
Dates and locations mentions: 1950s, 1960s, Toronto
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
SIDE C:
The audio on this tape is occasionally difficult to make out. Alldread mentions that his nephew is gay, and describes how his nephew is dealing with it. The audio becomes inaudible, and then becames audible again approx 11 minutes in. Alldread is describing his engagement and marriage — the…
appears good, audio poor (issues with noise, mic covered, music interrupts)
Scope and Content
SIDE C:
The audio on this tape is occasionally difficult to make out. Alldread mentions that his nephew is gay, and describes how his nephew is dealing with it. The audio becomes inaudible, and then becames audible again approx 11 minutes in. Alldread is describing his engagement and marriage — the two were married for 5 years. He also describes cruising in high park. He says he cruised more in later years due to loneliness. He also mentions Lynn Powers, a trans woman who was friends with Alldread when both were drag queens. He also describes a police encounter he had, while driving on Yonge St while in drag. The police noticed his gender presentation doesn’t match his ID. He is taken into the police car, and to a police station on Carlton. The police kicked him, tore off his fake eyelashes and wig, and called him names. The younger cop eventually drove him back home, and apologized to him. He describes later on going to a halloween party in drag, and discovering the other attendees were cops. But, the cops were respectful. He describes traveling a lot in the 1970s, and going to bathhouses without the fear of HIV/AIDS. He mentions how Italian men ran the Oakleaf. He also talks about going on a touring show, and having sex in drag. He describes Peter Marshall further.
Dates and locations discussed: Toronto, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s
SIDE D:
Alldread discusses how gay men do not always accept drag queens. He also mentions the various financial troubles associated with doing drag: second jobs, drug use, overspending, etc. He learned how to sew as part of saving money. He continues to describe his touring show: The Grand Imposters show. He describes some of his early loves and crushes. He mentions that Hanlan’s Point was a gay hub in 1950s, but feeling it is no longer gay. He also mentions going to visit Buffalo: “Toronto was dull, dull, dull”; Buffalo had “gays bars and ladies shoe stores”. Collier takes photos of Russell Alldread. They discuss their health habits. Russell answers the phone. The song Lovely Rita by The Beatles comes on near the end of the recording. Lionel and Russell discuss a photo of Russell in drag as a child.
Dates and locations discussed: 1950s, 1970s, 1980s, Toronto, Buffalo, USA
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
SIDES A and B:
Extremely poor audio. Andrews was born during the depression, in Stratford (this is difficult to make out). He is much younger than his siblings. Andrews discusses early sexual experiences with young men in neighbouring towns. Andrews asks about how confidential the interview was. An…
SIDES A and B:
Extremely poor audio. Andrews was born during the depression, in Stratford (this is difficult to make out). He is much younger than his siblings. Andrews discusses early sexual experiences with young men in neighbouring towns. Andrews asks about how confidential the interview was. Andrews discusses the 1950s (he was twenty at the time). As he got older, the men he was interested in were getting younger — he says at the time he didn’t have a name for this, but later learned the word “paedophilia”.
Dates and locations discussed: 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, Stratford, Toronto
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
SIDE C:
Ken begins to interview Lionel about growing up feminine in Oshawa. Lionel then asks Ken about Don Franco, and the two discuss Franco being arrested for supposedly having a ‘bawdy house’ in his home. Ken also discusses interacting with queer media, particular books and films. Ken suggests t…
SIDE C:
Ken begins to interview Lionel about growing up feminine in Oshawa. Lionel then asks Ken about Don Franco, and the two discuss Franco being arrested for supposedly having a ‘bawdy house’ in his home. Ken also discusses interacting with queer media, particular books and films. Ken suggests that the media too often focusses solely on suicides. Ken and Lionel discuss drag, and Ken recounts his first time seeing a drag show. Ken and Lionel discuss Peter Marshall and his home. Ken says Marshall’s wealth has to do with the Marshall mattress company. Ken mentions that he does not go to the St Charles as too many people die on their way back. Ken and Lionel also discuss the column Deirdre Hunter wrote for Tab, and her death (Deirdre was a trans woman who died from a heart attack shortly after having gender affirmation surgery).
Dates and locations discussed: Oshawa, Toronto, 1960s, 1970s, 1980s
SIDE D:
This very brief clip is mostly Lionel and Ken saying goodbye and thank you to one another after their interview.
Access Restrictions
N/A
Location - Original
CLGA only in possession of digital copy. Cassette tape retained by Lionel Collier
